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The long awaited Linn recording of The Creation from Boston Baroque. I will be very interested to read peoples experience of this. Interesting to see Michael Bishop on the credits. Could it be that Linn are picking up on ex Telarc artists AND engineering? There was an article in Gramophone magazine this month about Linn's release of high res downloads from Universal which it claims are to include newly released material. Could Universal be persuaded to give them SACD rights too if they won't issue any more SACDs themselves? Linn seem committed enough to SACD and would be worthy heirs to the Telarc dynasty. One UK distributor has a currrent special offer on Telarc with the SACDs priced higher than CDs. Has that always been the case or have Telarc's new owners realised the premium value of SACD?
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In the UK, Telarc SACD's were always priced higher than the RBCD release.
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Post by Chris July 7, 2012 (3 of 12)
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IMO, it seems this is yet another misguided,drastically scaled down tiny and scrawny?chamber orchestra version of a work that at its premiere had some 120 players in the orchestra and 60 choristers!!!
Three times bigger than this "scroogie HIP approach"!
Why? Are orchestras so expensive these days that Scottish label LINN once again can't afford a real orchestra of the size Haydn himself certainly would have expected in any serious performance of his masterwork?
Luckily I have Karajan's full scale BPO and Wiener Singverein version with world-class soloists like Gundula Janowitz, Christa Ludwig, Fritz Wunderlich, Werner Krenn, Dietrich Fisher Dieskau and Walter Berry on DGG LPs.
Now that would be a set worthy of releasing on SA-CD for those who haven't heard it on LP.
The new Linn no thanks.
I will stay true to the Full Monty approach.
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Post by wehecht July 17, 2012 (4 of 12)
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I've been listening to this for the last few days and I think it's really good. I don't miss the larger forces at all, as whatever the performance lacks in scale is more than compensated for in pure joyfulness. The recording, by former Telarc folks, is sweeter and smoother than some of their previous efforts with this band and venue. The big surprise, considering that this is an American performance of The Creation (in big letters on the package), is that it's really a performance of Die Schopfung (in small letters). If, like me, you listen first and read the liner notes later you'll be taken aback when the first words emerge: "Im Anfange", not "In the Beginning".
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wehecht said:
I've been listening to this for the last few days and I think it's really good. I don't miss the larger forces at all, as whatever the performance lacks in scale is more than compensated for in pure joyfulness. The recording, by former Telarc folks, is sweeter and smoother than some of their previous efforts with this band and venue. The big surprise, considering that this is an American performance of The Creation (in big letters on the package), is that it's really a performance of Die Schopfung (in small letters). If, like me, you listen first and read the liner notes later you'll be taken aback when the first words emerge: "Im Anfange", not "In the Beginning".
Glad to hear that. I prefer the German text even though it has been argued by some that the English is the original. Perhaps it is because I imprinted on the old Kempe/Berlin recording. FWIW, the Bolton Schopfung on Oehms is also listed with the English title and it is excellent.
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Post by seth July 17, 2012 (6 of 12)
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wehecht said:
I've been listening to this for the last few days and I think it's really good. I don't miss the larger forces at all, as whatever the performance lacks in scale is more than compensated for in pure joyfulness. The recording, by former Telarc folks, is sweeter and smoother than some of their previous efforts with this band and venue. The big surprise, considering that this is an American performance of The Creation (in big letters on the package), is that it's really a performance of Die Schopfung (in small letters). If, like me, you listen first and read the liner notes later you'll be taken aback when the first words emerge: "Im Anfange", not "In the Beginning".
Not to get into a HIP argument, but comparing a large 18th century orchestra to a large 21st century orchestra are apples and orangnes. Thanks to improvement in instrument technology and the fact that musicians today are far more skilled than their 18th C. predecessors (especially singers), a modern orchestra and choir is capably of making a lot more sound the same exact sized ensemble 200+ years ago. I've heard "The Creation" performed by chamber orchestras in large halls like Carnegie and Avery Fischer, and they have no problem producing a loud sound.
Clearly Haydn wanted a bigger than normal sound, but the number of musicians he used doesn't really tell what the exact loudness level was that he wanted, nor does it imply that he would approve "The Creation" being performed by a 110 piece orchestra plus a choir of similar size.
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Post by hiredfox July 18, 2012 (7 of 12)
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Is this a Sound Mirror recording?
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Post by Chris July 18, 2012 (8 of 12)
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hiredfox said:
Is this a Sound Mirror recording?
Probably no, the booklet info at Linn's Downloads site says Michael Bishops Five/Four Productions,so it could be a rare DSD recording released under the Linn label.
And to answer Kal,the original text was in German.
Judging by the snippets online at Linn it sounds a bit thin and smallish though.
Nothing for me. But I got my recent big bold and weighty, Barenboim Beethoven set from them and it is great.
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Chris said:
And to answer Kal,the original text was in German.
Actually, the original text was in English "The Creation of the World," and, although Haydn was inspired by Handel's English-language oratorios during his London visit, the libretto that Haydn composed for was in German. "Baron van Swieten.....is largely responsible for recasting the English libretto of The Creation in a German translation (Die Schöpfung) that Haydn could use to compose."
I am not defending the position that the English should be preferred since it is an ungainly match to the music but, rather, that there is a valid case made by some that the "original" text was in English.
Kal
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Post by Chris July 19, 2012 (10 of 12)
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Kal Rubinson said:
Actually, the original text was in English "The Creation of the World," and, although Haydn was inspired by Handel's English-language oratorios during his London visit, the libretto that Haydn composed for was in German. "Baron van Swieten.....is largely responsible for recasting the English libretto of The Creation in a German translation (Die Schöpfung) that Haydn could use to compose."
I am not defending the position that the English should be preferred since it is an ungainly match to the music but, rather, that there is a valid case made by some that the "original" text was in English.
Kal
Kal,You are definitely correct as to the origin of the text. But what Haydn set to music was the German translation/version of that text by van Swieten. And that is what I meant.
I think we need to differentiate beween original and origin here.
Correct me if I am wrong.
And therefore English is an ungainly match indeed compared to the "original" German.
Handel's Oratorios are a completely different matter as far as the texts are concerned.
And musically,neither of Haydn's Oratories can compare to Messiah anyway imho.
But to get back to Haydn and this release,In the excellent booklet that came with Karajan's Die Schöpfung on DGG LPs, there is even a facsimile of "DAS VAN SWIETENSCHE TEXTBUCH DES ORATORIUMS DIE SCHÖPFUNG HANDSCHRIFTLICHES EXEMPLAR AUS HAYDNS NACHLASS"
Just one of many many treasures from the DGG catalogue of the 60s and 70s when one got not only good music but also "edutainment"long before the term was invented.Wonderful artwork and very well documented information about both the composers,the history and backgrounds of their works and their contemporaries in other arts.
If that recording and many other sets from those days, were released on SA -CD or as hi res downloads with the full original documentation at reasonable prices,that would be nice indeed.
So far there is but a trickle..
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