Post by bissie January 16, 2009 (61 of 321)
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wehecht said:
Robert,
I understand about the double inventory and incremental pricing issues. I've always thought you've done this exactly right as opposed to several of your "independent" brethren who've screwed it up from day one, and I won't even comment on the so-called "majors". My personal approach to this issue would be to raise the price of all BIS product by a modest amount, say $1, and effectively spread the sacd production costs across the whole product line. Given the A&R and production values of BIS I can't imagine it would reduce sales in any measurable way, i.e. will someone buy a Fartein Valen cd at $17 but not at $18 or $19?
A couple of totally unrelated matters. First, congratulations on your well deserved lifetime achievement award. Second, is the Rachmaninov 2nd symphony recording a "one off" or might we have hope that the 1st and 3rd will appear in due course?
Finally, returning to the subject of sacd economics, I'll close by saying that I've taken the only action within my exclusive control: I just placed an order for 8 BIS sacds that were previously on my "maybe/maybe not" list.
Bill
Thanks for your thoughtful comments.
As you will have seen above, we already are in the top-price category (given the time we spend on every production, we have to be). Whereas I agree with the Valen case, to raise even further would seriously harm sales on our normal repertoire.
The Rach probably was a one-off. We already have them with Owain Arwel-Hughes.
That is sweet of you. And that's precisely what we will need to keep this up.
Best and thanks - Robert
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Post by Anders January 16, 2009 (62 of 321)
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bissie said:
Hello,
this is Robert from BIS, aka bissie.
In the current business climate even we have to look at bean-counting.
Since we release all our SACD:s as Hybrids and since we don't charge a premium, but absorb the extra costs for recording, editing, mastering and production of an SACD, selling at the same price as a RBCD,
*I would be extremely interested in knowing how many EXTRA copies we sell because of the SACD option.*
Mathematically, starting from the edited master tape, we need to sell some 600 EXTRA copies of the production in order to break even for the extra costs of producing the SACD, compared to releasing only a RBCD.
Question: do we do it? Since we don't have double inventory, there is no way for me to tell.
Obviously there are other factors as well: prestige, good-will, satisfaction with a superb product, but, when it comes to paying the salaries (BIS is nowadays probably the only classical company in the world with its own, full-time production staff - we have 7 producers/engineers hired that roam the 6 continents of the world recording with our own equipment) we need the green stuff.
So, since this would be the relevant Forum to ask something like that: how many of you, who do buy the occasional BIS SACD would abstain from doing so, were the identical programme to appear only as RBCD?
I think this is a relevant question to put, especially so, since many of my colleagues seemingly have made the same calculation - and then abandoned SACD.
Best - Robert
I stopped buying RBCDs during the 90s because of the bad sound. I had tried different CD-players but was not able to find any that sounded to my satisfaction. Especially violins, female voices and brass instrument were terrible.
All that changed when DSD recordings and SACD came. So I have aquired quite a few SACDs during the past 10 years.
I can honestly say that I will not buy one single RBCD in the future. If I don´t have the possibility to enjoy new DSD recordings I will listen to the treasures I already have, to radio (where I live I can listen to both swedish and danish radio)and of course live concerts (Malmö and Copenhagen).
Best - Anders
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bissie said:
So, since this would be the relevant Forum to ask something like that: how many of you, who do buy the occasional BIS SACD would abstain from doing so, were the identical programme to appear only as RBCD?
I think this is a relevant question to put, especially so, since many of my colleagues seemingly have made the same calculation - and then abandoned SACD.
Best - Robert
Recently I purchased 2 BIS releases - Mozart: Complete Works for Flute & Orchestra - Bezaly and "Airs and Graces, Scottish Tunes and London Sonatas". I would have abstain from buying if they were released as rbcd only. And the same for many other labels releases. I'm ready to pay extra cost for superior quality.
Good luck to you and your BISsiness!
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Post by bissie January 16, 2009 (64 of 321)
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nucaleena said:
dear bissie,
i only buy SACD now (except cds for friends) and have only bought BIS SACDS (as opposed to BIS cds) for about 5 or 6years. If (and please dont) BIS dropped uut of the SACD market, I'd folow the medium (SACD) and buy more SACDs from other labels. AT the moment, I buy every one of your SACDs as soon as it appears.
cheers, paul
As I said to Bill, this is what is needed. Thank you.
Please, everyone, keep the answers coming in. I have to say that I am impressed by the quantity and quality of the answers, and, yes, they will form a basis for our future decisions.
Best - Robert
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Post by Perigo January 16, 2009 (65 of 321)
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In the last 5/6 years the 85% of the 700/800 titles I bought was in SACD format. It is not important if hybrid with CD layer or full and only SACD, because I bought them first of all for the SACD layer.
Unfortunately, from BIS catalogue very very few, probably because I don't find many titles that move my interest.
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Post by EmNat January 16, 2009 (66 of 321)
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Dear Bissie,
I've purchased only SACD for the last few years and owned 35 BIS SACD. I hope that BIS will continue to produce lots of quality SACDs.
Regards,
EmNat
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Post by amatala January 16, 2009 (67 of 321)
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Hi Robert,
I'm not your typical customer, but I'll throw in my 2 cents like everyone else.
I mainly a rock listener (this means I mostly buy RBCDs nowadays...), but I do enjoy listening to good jazz and classical performances.
Here are a few points:
- I only buy jazz and classical music on SACD
- I only buy hybrid SACDs - I want to be able to rip the CD layer to FLAC and listen to it on my music server
- I am willing to pay extra (within reasonable limits) for hybrid multichannel SACDs
- I will buy a hybrid stereo SACD only if it is sold at the same price as the RBCD version. I currently consider stereo SACD to be only marginally better than CD, not enough to justify paying extra for it.
All these are personal opinions, of course.
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Post by ealopez January 16, 2009 (68 of 321)
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Hi Robert,
In the last 2 years 90% of the 250 titles I bought were SACDs and 10% LPs. For instance, yesterday I placed an order at acoustic sounds for 26 SACDs where 11 of them were BIS SACDs:
1) Ronald Brautigam, Beethoven: Piano Concertos Nos. 1 & 3
2) Martin Gester, Handel: Twelve Grand Concertos
3) Martin Frost - Von Weber: Clarinet Concertos
4) Ole Kristian Ruud - Grieg: In Autumn/ Piano Concerto/ Symphony in C Minor
5) Frost, Pontinen & Thedeen - Brahms: Clarinet Sonatas & Trio
6) Ronald Brautigam - Beethoven: Complete Works for Solo Piano, Volume 6
7) Ole Kristian Ruud - Grieg: Holberg Suite Music for Strings
8) Ole Kristian Ruud - Edvard Grieg: Norwegian Dances, Op.35 ; Symphonic Dances, Op.64 ; Lyric Suite, Op.54
9) Ole Kristian Ruud - Grieg: Olav Trygvason, Orchestral Songs
10) John Neschling - Shilkret: Concerto for Trombone & Orchestra
11) Osmo Vanska - Beethoven: Symphonies No. 4 & 5
I do not plan to buy RBCD. I do hope you keep producing high quality SACDs.
Regards
Enrique
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Post by lucas January 16, 2009 (69 of 321)
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For classical music I only buy MC-SACD's. For the last 5 years I bought aprox. 20 SACD's a year.
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Post by hanser January 16, 2009 (70 of 321)
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As a follow up to my first reply, perhaps it is helpful to know my simple buying rules: I spend generelly no more than 10 Euro for a CD (or DVD), and no more than 20 Euro for a SACD (or Blu-ray). This is simply how I perceive their worth. And this excludes automatically most new releases on CD.
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