Post by terence September 30, 2008 (1 of 26)
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great review thanks.
anybody got a timing on symphony 7?
and how bad are ashkenazy's gruntings? in the colin davis category?
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Post by andrewb September 30, 2008 (2 of 26)
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terence said:
anybody got a timing on symphony 7?
and how bad are ashkenazy's gruntings? in the colin davis category?
Symphony 6
1. 9:04
2. 5:22
3. 3.37
4. 9:01
Symphony 7
5. 20:36
Karelia Suite
6. 4:10
7. 7:55
8. 4:36
Valse Triste
9. 5:01
I have not seriously listened to this yet, there is the very occasional grunt or singing from Ashkenazy in the 6th but nothing serious and it did not bother me. There is also some muffled audience noise (might be platform noise but I think audience), especially at the start of movements, like on many other Exton recordings.
Very good performances, but as so often with Exton I find the sound a bit close, lacking both space and tonal refinement. However, others members of this forum seem to be very happy with the Exton sound quality.
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Post by terence December 12, 2008 (3 of 26)
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thanks. is audience applause retained or omitted?
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Post by DSD July 9, 2011 (5 of 26)
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Hot damn! Finally my favorite Sibelius composition "Karelia Suite" with deep bass on SACD and it is an exciting performance as well. The bass doesn't have the impact or presence of a good Telarc but it is quite acceptable. Valse Triste is quite beautiful. I have not heard the 6th & 7th Symphonies before so I cannot comment on them.
My Sibelius collection is starting to shape up
Sibelius: Kullervo - Spano
Sibelius: Symphony No. 2, Tubin: Symphony No. 5 - Cincinnati SO/Järvi
Sibelius: Symphonies Nos. 6 & 7 - Ashkenazy
Lemminkäinen Suite: Four Legends from the "Kalevala" - Ormandy, The Philadelphia Orchestra [Apple Lossless 24/96 from Vinyl] Mobile Fidelity Sound Lab **Thanks Donald Cramer for the recommendation.
The Tempest: Suites Nos. 1 and 2 - Stern, Kansas City Symphony [Apple Lossless 24/96] Reference Recordings
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DSD said:
Hot damn! Finally my favorite Sibelius composition "Karelia Suite" with deep bass on SACD and it is an exciting performance as well.
You surprised me with this comment. This disc has been around for a long time and usually you have all bases covered on new DSD releases. Good set overall but Davis still rules.
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Post by Chris July 9, 2011 (7 of 26)
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DSD said:
Hot damn! Finally my favorite Sibelius composition "Karelia Suite" with deep bass and it is an exciting performance as well. The bass doesn't have the impact or presence of a good Telarc but it is quite acceptable. Valse Triste is quite beautiful. I have not heard the 6th & 7th Symphonies before so I cannot comment on them.
My Sibelius collection is starting shape up
Sibelius: Kullervo - Spano
Sibelius: Symphony No. 2, Tubin: Symphony No. 5 - Cincinnati SO/Järvi
Sibelius: Symphonies Nos. 6 & 7 - Ashkenazy
Lemminkäinen Suite: Four Legends from the "Kalevala" - Ormandy, The Philadelphia Orchestra [Apple Lossless 24/96 from Vinyl] Mobile Fidelity Sound Lab **Thanks Donald Cramer for the recommendation.
The Tempest: Suites Nos. 1 and 2 - Stern, Kansas City Symphony [Apple Lossless 24/96] Reference Recordings
Each to his or her own.
But FYI there are several others with deep bass,one of them,the BIS SACD of Sibelius' music.
And furthermore,as usual from Exton,a zillion of mics were used.Basically a jungle of mics and wires everywhere at Exton's sessions in Stockholm.
With all the mixing necessary from such an approach to Classical Music performed in a real venue but crudely overmiked,I really wonder how they can really stay in pure DSD?
The same applies to the ones I have seen in Prague.
I must confess I haven't heard this recording,so I can't comment on it.But from what I have heard from Exton before,IMO they often deliver a too artificial studio sound that may be impressive on MID FI FI Equipment but tiring on repeated hearings,when played via a really revealing high quality chain. A bit like DECCA Phase 4 in the analogue days.
"POP recording approaches" to classical tend to throw away the natural ambience and replace it with phasey artificial,very upfront,in your face,multi mono sound.
At least in plain stereo. It may sound better in MCH.
If my memory serves me right I think there were in the region of 40 or so mics used at the EXTON sessions I have been present at.
IMO far too many!
Teresa, if you ever visited a TELARC session,would probably also be surprised if you actually got to see all the mics used at Telarc's sessions,not to mention all the ON Stage Acoustic Treatment : Diffusors and Abffusors used at Telarc's US sessions.
I haven't seen any of the other companies recording Classical Music use such a clear pop studio approach as Telarc in that respect.
I know you came to Classical music via POP and Rock and therefore I am not suprised that you so like TELARC's modern US production style, because IMO many of their later, post Soundstream, SACDs recorded in the US sound a bit like POP recordings. Their European ones are generally better,because there at least for the first ones,they worked with recording engineers with a basic approach of how classical music sounds live in a real venue,and how to mike it to sound realistic! not only superficially impressive to someone who wants to show of his or her MIDFIHIFI.
Their most natural approach was in the early days of digital and direct to disc.
In those days they still used a basic mic tecnique that preserved natural balances and ambience better than their more recent ones from Atlanta and Cincinatti.
Some of the early Telarc SACDs from London made by Polyhymnia still sound excellent and very natural.Clearly better and more realistic than the ones where they brought over their own balancing engineers from the US IMO.
I will agree with you though,that the Ormandy Sibelius disc, also multimiked of course, but more naturally ambient than anything I have heard from Exton, is quite good for its age,at least in its orginal Mobile Fidelity release on LP.
I wouldn't part from my "Not for Sale Demonstration Copy" for anything less than BIG MONEY.
PS. Apple lossless is as far as I have been told and heard,,not quite loss less!
For real hi res digital files you should stay away from Apple's own programs and solutions. There are better ones than theirs. To really hear what hi res downloads can sound like,try for example PM1.8a and DO get a decent DAC.SQ straight out of any mac as you play yours,is not really delivering the full potential of your hi res files!
SQ does not seem to have very high priority for Mr Jobs.
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Post by Deribas July 9, 2011 (8 of 26)
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Chris said:
PS. Apple lossless is as far as I have been told and heard,,not quite loss less!
For real hi res digital files you should stay away from Apple's own programs and solutions. There are better ones than theirs. To really hear what hi res downloads can sound like,try for example PM1.8a and DO get a decent DAC.SQ straight out of any mac as you play yours,is not really delivering the full potential of your hi res files!
SQ does not seem to have very high priority for Mr Jobs.
Sorry for straying off-topic here, but have you any attribution for your statement (other than the part that you can allegedly hear)? I know that apple-bashing is quite popular in some quarters, but... Apple lossless (ALAC) is just that, completely interconvertible with other lossless formats (FLAC, notably) back and forth, preserving bit-perfect content of the original AIFF files, assuming it came from a CD.
I have listened to 24-bit, 96 kHz ALAC files, which I converted from FLAC downloads, on my squeezebox touch connected to a good sound system, and they sound indistinguishable from the original FLAC files of the same music.
I agree, though, that at this point in his life, Steve Jobs may have higher priorities indeed.
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Post by DSD July 9, 2011 (9 of 26)
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Chris said:
Teresa, if you ever visited a TELARC session,would probably also be surprised if you actually got to see all the mics used at Telarc's sessions,not to mention all the ON Stage Acoustic Treatment : Diffusors and Abffusors used at Telarc's US sessions.
Chris I have written extensively about Telarc's recording techniques at my Telarc High Resolution Fan Club blog. If this was a Michael Bishop orchestral production and there were no solo instruments or chorus there should have been 11 mics total (4 for stereo and 7 for multichannel) since the stereo program has its own dedicated microphones and Michael uses two center mics compared to Jack Renner's one.
Telarc is FAMOUS for not only the use of acoustic treatments and spending the time necessary to fine tune the sonics of an empty concert hall to make everything sound NATURAL. They have been know to completely remove the first two rows of seats or at least cover them, and move things around to improve the sonics. This is why they are an AUDIOPHILE company. Not at all what Pop studios do whose results are NOT natural and could NEVER be considered audiophile.
The Polyhymnia recorded European Telarc's are several sonic steps below Michael Bishop's or Jack Renner's results IMHO.
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DSD said:
Chris I have written extensive about Telarc's recording techniques at my Telarc High Resolution Fan Club blog. If this was a Michael Bishop orchestral production and there were no solo instruments or chorus there should have been 11 mics total (4 for stereo and 7 for multichannel) since the stereo program has its own dedicated microphones and Michael uses two center mics compared to Jack Renner's one.
Telarc is FAMOUS for not only the use of acoustic treatments and spending the time necessary to fine tune the sonics of an empty concert hall to make everything sound NATURAL. They have been know to completely remove the first two rows of seats or at least cover them, and move things around to improve the sonics. This is why they are an AUDIOPHILE company. Not at all what Pop studios do whose results are NOT natural and could NEVER be considered audiophile.
The Polyhymnia recorded European Telarc's are several sonic steps below Michael Bishop's or Jack Renner's results IMHO.
The Polyhymnia recorded Telarcs probably have more natural bass than Michael Bishops OTT recordings.
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