Post by hiredfox September 2, 2012 (31 of 38)
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armenian said:
For me audio is repeatable, video is not, just like viewing a movie once or twice I quickly reach the limit, after a few plays I simply can not watch that thing again, with repeated replay a video becomes awfully boring and gets in the way of music.
Vahe
One can experience an analogous effect with books. Good books that I have read many times over have been largely ruined for me by watching a screen adaptation.
Music and books conjure up images in one's imagination that are uncluttered by outside influences; each of us will experience quite individual emotions which may not bear any resemblance to another's.
Setting images on screen seems to impart a degree of qausi-authoritative permanence to one person's very narrow view of a work; once cast the images can destroy the mystery of a work simply because far too many people accept without challenge that the screen version as the 'right' way to interpret the work and of course it gets talked about and tweeted about endlessly so none of us are immune.
Then again, many people watch films over and over and always enjoy each viewing as if it was their first. I am more like you, quite unable to bear watching anything more than once but could listen to one Mahler symphony for ever.
That should keep the trick-cyclists busy awhile.
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armenian said:
For me audio is repeatable, video is not, just like viewing a movie once or twice I quickly reach the limit, after a few plays I simply can not watch that thing again, with repeated replay a video becomes awfully boring and gets in the way of music.
Vahe
To each his or her own, of course. But, I disagree. First, audio plus video more closely resembles the live concert experience and the totality of sensory experience in that setting, including the visual one. That allows us far greater insight into details of the orchestration and how the composer achieved his intentions in the score via concert videos. Much of this is not obvious from the soundtrack alone. Certainly for opera or ballet, we see the total performance the composer intended, including the stage component. Details of the acting by opera singers are often not even accessable live, except with binoculars, which is an awkward and uncomfortable way to view them live. We also see a different dimension, not just the audible one, of the performance, the passion and emotion of the performers themselves. To me this greatly heightens the musical experience in a way that has come to be my preferred method of musical enjoyment in the home via Blu-ray, eclipsing all others for concerts, operas and ballets.
I realize that after over 100 years of audio only reproduction in the home, old habits of listening to the sound alone are hard to break for most traditional audiophiles. But, I am no video junkie, and I do not collect movies. I am an audiophile/music lover with many decades of live and recorded experience. Having the hi def video plus good hi Rez audio is to me simply the best, and I do not turn off the video on repeat playings of my growing collection. In my small circle of similar long standing audio/ music loving geezers, we have all come to the same preference for A/V Blu-ray as the best, most intense and involving music reproduction we have experienced thus far in our lifetimes.
We still, of course, listen to SACD and other audio only media. But, to us now, something important seems to be missing from audio only recordings, no matter how excellent even on our superb hi Rez Mch setups.
I think it is an interesting question as to what future generations of classical music lovers will prefer. Younger audiences are much more used to and tolerant of video, and they may well come prefer audio plus video over audio only. So, possibly, this is the way of the future. As it is, it is even now a new and growing niche, though much smaller than SACD, that offers many musical delights and alternatives to traditional audio only recordings. I love it.
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Post by Iain September 2, 2012 (33 of 38)
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Fitzcaraldo215 said:
To each his or her own, of course. But, I disagree. First, audio plus video more closely resembles the live concert experience and the totality of sensory experience in that setting, including the visual one. That allows us far greater insight into details of the orchestration and how the composer achieved his intentions in the score via concert videos. Much of this is not obvious from the soundtrack alone. Certainly for opera or ballet, we see the total performance the composer intended, including the stage component. Details of the acting by opera singers are often not even accessable live, except with binoculars, which is an awkward and uncomfortable way to view them live. We also see a different dimension, not just the audible one, of the performance, the passion and emotion of the performers themselves. To me this greatly heightens the musical experience in a way that has come to be my preferred method of musical enjoyment in the home via Blu-ray, eclipsing all others for concerts, operas and ballets.
............
Sort of OT here, but even though I'm not fond of opera, music of Bizet's "Carmen" is often in my head. LOL!! : )
Been looking for quality BD version of it, but don't really know where to start. I would not want 2 or 3 versions of it on my shelf. Just one recent, quality version. Preferably in DTS-HD Master Audio.
Any recommendations?
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Post by Hedgehog September 3, 2012 (34 of 38)
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Has to be the Decca, with Antonacci, Kaufmann and D'Arcangelo, and Pappano conducts ROH forces to bristling effect. Fairly trad production, but that's no bad thing. Lots of heat from Antonacci, and Kaufmann's singing is truly sublime; if his Flower Song does not break your heart, nothing ever will. Lots of passion and drama throughout. This will remind you what a great piece it is.
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Post by Iain September 3, 2012 (35 of 38)
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Hedgehog said:
Has to be the Decca, with Antonacci, Kaufmann and D'Arcangelo, and Pappano conducts ROH forces to bristling effect. Fairly trad production, but that's no bad thing. Lots of heat from Antonacci, and Kaufmann's singing is truly sublime; if his Flower Song does not break your heart, nothing ever will. Lots of passion and drama throughout. This will remind you what a great piece it is.
Perfect match, indeed. It's the one I've been considering for some time, but wasn't quite sure of it.
Thanks.
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hiredfox said:
One can experience an analogous effect with books. Good books that I have read many times over have been largely ruined for me by watching a screen adaptation.
Music and books conjure up images in one's imagination that are uncluttered by outside influences; each of us will experience quite individual emotions which may not bear any resemblance to another's.
Setting images on screen seems to impart a degree of qausi-authoritative permanence to one person's very narrow view of a work; once cast the images can destroy the mystery of a work simply because far too many people accept without challenge that the screen version as the 'right' way to interpret the work and of course it gets talked about and tweeted about endlessly so none of us are immune.
Then again, many people watch films over and over and always enjoy each viewing as if it was their first. I am more like you, quite unable to bear watching anything more than once but could listen to one Mahler symphony for ever.
That should keep the trick-cyclists busy awhile.
I would agree if you are talking about Peter Jackson's Lord of the Rings movies. On the other hand, I appreciate what Boulez and Chicago did with The Miraculous Mandarin, Beyond the Score.
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Post by hiredfox September 3, 2012 (37 of 38)
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Fitzcaraldo215 said:
To each his or her own, of course. But, I disagree. First, audio plus video more closely resembles the live concert experience and the totality of sensory experience in that setting, including the visual one. etc
Fair enough and many of the points you make are true nevertheless you are always at the mercy of the cameraman / producer and you are rather stuck with what they decide to edit into the DVD images. You cannot for example decide to watch different musicians next time through if they have decided never to show them.
Audio editors cannot leave musicians out however much they maul the music!
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Post by Tourboots September 3, 2012 (38 of 38)
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Fitzcaraldo215 said:
To each his or her own, of course. But, I disagree. First, audio plus video more closely resembles the live concert experience and the totality of sensory experience in that setting, including the visual one.
As you rightly say, to each his own and I do enjoy watching some DVD performances of concerts and have a number of them. But by far I love to have CDs or preferably multichannel SACDs, so that 1. I can either play the music in the background while I am doing other things around the house. 2. That I can have access to music again in any part of the house or in the car or on the move and am not restricted to a TV set up and 3. probably the most important for me is the fact that often I just want to sit and sometime turn the lights off or shut my eyes and let my ears just absorb the music and this is when I love SACD Multichannel the best I hear the sound and feel the dynamics of movement and the elements that make up the music without any visual distractions. I often do this at concerts as well, I do not always want the visual distraction.
I also approach music reproduction as just that, an SACD or CD is a medium in its own right and is a way of listening to music, just as a concert is, but it does not always have to present music as though we are in a concert. So I love it when surround is used in a creative way and the medium itself comes to life and helps to interpret the music in a new and different way.
I certainly respect the opinions of those who see these things differently and I can totally understand their reasoning. But SACD is for me a perfect solution for something I have wanted for many years, the ability to enjoy my music in multichannel. I do not want an expensive carrier system with lots of features I will never play or want, hence I don't buy any BD-A discs, but that is my choice and it is not to say that those who do want them, should not have them made available to them. Equally, I feel that SACD should be available, at reasonable prices, to those for whom it matches their needs and requirements. For me SACD gives me what I want - the music, in surround and nothing else, and I have more SACDs and CDs than I do DVDs of concerts in my collection.
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