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Allen said:
Just curious of one thing about this series:
Are these really live recording? I mean, is the applause taken out completely from the performance?
Normally I do not buy CD or SACD if they contain such "live" elements. Just found out that some LSO releases sometimes have the zeal applause at the end. That alone will make me not to buy from that series.
???
You know, there are some recordings that I play that when the music is over, I yell, YES! or even BRAVO and clap just a few seconds or so. When there is recorded genuine applause from that recorded performance, I do not feel so stupid as I do when there is just silence.
IN well recorded multi-channel the applause is a plus because you get an extra dimension - more information about the venue. I like to be placed about 10 or 12 rows from the center of the stage and hear the applause from the rear, the sides, and in front of me. The experience truly transforms my listening room.
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Post by tream February 25, 2009 (32 of 49)
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Windsurfer said:
???
You know, there are some recordings that I play that when the music is over, I yell, YES! or even BRAVO and clap just a few seconds or so. When there is recorded genuine applause from that recorded performance, I do not feel so stupid as I do when there is just silence.
IN well recorded multi-channel the applause is a plus because you get an extra dimension - more information about the venue. I like to be placed about 10 or 12 rows from the center of the stage and hear the applause from the rear, the sides, and in front of me. The experience truly transforms my listening room.
I asked the same question on audioasylum on these recordings and there was a flurry of support for applause...but I have to say that I find it disfiguring. Personal view, but I just don't want to have the experience interrupted by the same applause each and every time I play a recording. As you said - some idiot applauded just before the ending on the Ravel - couldn't they have done a post production clean up on this?
Many, many successful recordings have been made in front of live audiences without the need to include the applause -Bernstein's DG recordings, the SFS/MTT Mahlers, and the LSO Live symphonic recordings are all sans applause (the LSO Live opera recordings that I have heard include audience participation).
I like the sense of John Culshaw's "theater of the mind" where one is free to imagine a performance of a work in a platonically ideal way - applause brings it down to a specific event that happened at a specific time - maybe others like this in recording, but I want my recordings to represent a universal time and place, not a specific one. Furthermore, at home, I often like to muse about the music - and applause totally disrupts this. Hitting the off button is not a fix - usually the applause starts while the music is still decaying in the hall.
Coughs and other extraneous audience noise should also be cleaned up as well. While we have to put up with this during live performances there is no reason to perpetuate this in a recording.
Not all agree....but for me inclusion of applause is often a deal breaker, because I know I won't want to listen to the recording multiple times.
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Post by terence February 25, 2009 (33 of 49)
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i tend to agree. in this case though i really would like to support the boston initiative and buy, if the performance is good and the multichannel mix is too.
so far on the latter point i'm getting fairly negative noises.
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Post by synthy February 25, 2009 (34 of 49)
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terence said:
so not much surround info on the rear speakers then?
It's definitely there, I just need to bump it up a few dB before the hall sounds like it extends behind me
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Post by Allen February 25, 2009 (35 of 49)
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Peter said:
Which LSO Live releases have applause?
It is not the SACD I am refering to. I am talking about their CD release of Verdi's Falstaff.
I know one of their Beethoven SACDs (which I own) does not have this issue, though.
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Post by Allen February 25, 2009 (36 of 49)
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tream said:
... the LSO Live symphonic recordings are all sans applause (the LSO Live opera recordings that I have heard include audience participation).
There is a real relief. I am not a fan of LSO live after I bought their B9 SACD and found out the recording level is way too low than normal. So I kind of put this label aside.
But my last weekend's sampling of their Falstaff really really turned me off. The same goes to DG's new release of La Traviata. That makes me stop all purchase decision of their opera without input from those who already owned the title.
Just a personal preference, a very strong one, I have to admit. If I want to listen to live music, I will go to concert or watch the live video. But a music CD/SACD, it is better be as clean as possible.
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Post by mahlerei February 25, 2009 (37 of 49)
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Goodness, you are a picky lot. Most of you won't listen to RBCDs - thus depriving youselves of some of the greatest performances ever recorded - and the rest of you won't buy 'live' SACDs with applause included. What's left, I wonder?
I agree with Windsurfer, the applause can add real frisson to a live recording. One of my all-time favourites is the live 1958 Horenstein Mahler 8, a sonic marvel for its time and a staggering performance that has the audience on its feet at the end. It never ceases to thrill, however many times I listen to it. Of course those of you who shun RBCDs won't have heard it - more's the pity.
Anyway, if applause bugs you that much program it out. It's that simple. But to deny yourself the pleasure of a potentially fine performance on such flimsy grounds just beggars belief.
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Post by Allen February 25, 2009 (38 of 49)
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mahlerei said:
Goodness, you are a picky lot. Most of you won't listen to RBCDs - thus depriving youselves of some of the greatest performances ever recorded - and the rest of you won't buy 'live' SACDs with applause included. What's left, I wonder?
....
Anyway, if applause bugs you that much program it out. It's that simple. But to deny yourself the pleasure of a potentially fine performance on such flimsy grounds just beggars belief.
Hey, it is personal stuff, alright? My dislike of applause has nothing to do with other's dislike of RBCD. I have to make it clear :-) I do listen to RBCD, for a lot of pop and opera stuff, CD is still the only place to look.
Again, like or dislike, it is just a personal preference. I am asking because I do not want to buy the wrong stuff.
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Post by Cherubino February 25, 2009 (39 of 49)
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Allen said:
Hey, it is personal stuff, alright? My dislike of applause has nothing to do with other's dislike of RBCD. I have to make it clear :-) I do listen to RBCD, for a lot of pop and opera stuff, CD is still the only place to look.
Again, like or dislike, it is just a personal preference. I am asking because I do not want to buy the wrong stuff.
I don't care for applause in recordings either, however, at least on a recording you actually get to hear the end of the piece before those audience members who suffer from "Radetsky March Syndrome, those who just can't wait to get into the act, jump in, and smother the final notes, notes that most composers I suspect consider an important part of their composition. This phenomenon is particularly egregious in the opera house where many (too many) audience members interpret the curtain starting to come down as a flashing, pulsing "applause" sign, even though the orchestra for some reason is still playing.
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Post by TerraEpon February 25, 2009 (40 of 49)
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I really can't comprehend what dictates to someone that they should forgo a superb recording because it happens to have applause at the end. Sure, for many its a sore point but THAT sore ???
It mainly annoys me when it goes on forever, though I don't like it much either. A few seconds? Sure. 30? I have to ask why? Especially as often times the sound quality seems to really waver in it for some reason.
I also don't buy live performances where there's any sort of announcement or whatnot, outside of a couple very specific circumstances.
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