Post by Goodwood January 26, 2007 (11 of 21)
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A few fatal flaws in logic.
1) I don't drive a Ferrari so Ferraris are dead.
2) My local music store doesn't sell Ferraris so Ferraris are dead
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Post by azure January 26, 2007 (12 of 21)
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zeus said:
I'm a bit confused here:
The PS3 supports HDMI 1.3 ... right?
There's currently no receivers that support HDMI 1.2 or 1.3 but they're coming later this year ... right?
I gather you can output either PCM or DSD (ie. there is a DSD to PCM converter on board)through the HDMI outlet..
I suppose this choice is in anticipation for future AVRs??????
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In spite of what I posted above, I did come across this edition of the new Enigma album on some major auction site.
It is listed as a (Chinese) 2-disc CD from Hong Kong.
Note the prominent DSD logo at the top.
Now I wonder:
- is this perhaps an SACD?
- is it one of those discs that were recorded in DSD but released as 'DSD CD' on RBCD (I've seen a number of those in Singapore)
- is it a fake? (the logo or the whole edition)
Any clues? The HMV HK site does not list any such version.
One thing that makes me suspect the release may be a sort of bootleg is the fact that the second disc simply contains the entire first album, and also to the first disc they seem to have added an earlier track.
EDIT: If you search for "Enigma Posteriori DSD" you'll find various matches from Chinese sites where this is a 1-disc edition without the added tracks from earlier albums. In the meantime I'm 99% sure this is an RBCD but wonder: was it actually recorded in DSD or do they just put that on because then they can charge more for it?
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Post by Julien March 30, 2007 (14 of 21)
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The Seventh Taylor said:
In the meantime I'm 99% sure this is an RBCD but wonder: was it actually recorded in DSD or do they just put that on because then they can charge more for it?
The same happened with HDCD, when it was a new technology it was written everywhere just to sell (still at very cheap prices between 10 and 15 yuan, which is 1 to 1.5 euro). Until now most of the CDs you buy in stores or in the street are HDCDs.
About DSD, I see plenty of originally very bad pop PCM recordings that have DSD on the cover of the reeditions. Most of it is a lie, very few studios can record in DSD in mainland China, and when they do it they release it on CD as you said. HK does a few real pop SACDs though, I don't know how they sound and am not interested in cheap Chinese pop anyway (I'm in the show business and I can tell that most of these guys really can't sing, they do take after take, one cut every note, have to modify the intonation they never get right even after 20 takes...)
Anyway, you were right in everything you guessed, and my guess is that either it is a fake, either it is bad DSD remastered to bad PCM.
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Post by Claude March 30, 2007 (15 of 21)
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I'm not sure mega-productions such as Enigma could be recorded in DSD, as the equipment is quite limited as to the maximum number of tracks and mixing/editing possibilities.
Anyway, if the disc is a counterfeit all this info on the stickers is probably wrong. I've seen auctions of chinese discs claiming to be SACD/XRCD hybrids ...
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Post by soundboy March 30, 2007 (16 of 21)
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Julien said:
HK does a few real pop SACDs though, I don't know how they sound and am not interested in cheap Chinese pop anyway (I'm in the show business and I can tell that most of these guys really can't sing, they do take after take, one cut every note, have to modify the intonation they never get right even after 20 takes...)
Almost all Hong Kong pop SACDs are music from 70s and 80s, Julien. Almost none of the current HK pop singers have any SACDs out.
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Post by soundboy March 31, 2007 (17 of 21)
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Claude said:
Anyway, if the disc is a counterfeit all this info on the stickers is probably wrong. I've seen auctions of chinese discs claiming to be SACD/XRCD hybrids ...
SACD/XRCD hybrids was proposed by Hugo Productions of Hong Kong, which is a label specializing in recording traditional Chinese music and has several SACD titles under its belt. JVC, which owns the rights to XRCD, declined to cooperate for the project.
There're SACD/HDCD hybrids though....the hybrid SACD of Dave Brubeck's "Time Out", Dire Straits' Brothers in Arms", Lee Ann Womack's "Greatest Hits", etc. are all HDCD-encoded on the CD layer, yet unmarked as such on both the packaging and the disc. First Impression Music (FIM) also releases SACD/HDCD hybrids.
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Post by soundboy March 31, 2007 (18 of 21)
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The Seventh Taylor said:
In spite of what I posted above, I did come across this edition of the new Enigma album on some major auction site.
It is listed as a (Chinese) 2-disc CD from Hong Kong.
Note the prominent DSD logo at the top.
Now I wonder:
- is this perhaps an SACD?
- is it one of those discs that were recorded in DSD but released as 'DSD CD' on RBCD (I've seen a number of those in Singapore)
- is it a fake? (the logo or the whole edition)
Any clues? The HMV HK site does not list any such version.
One thing that makes me suspect the release may be a sort of bootleg is the fact that the second disc simply contains the entire first album, and also to the first disc they seem to have added an earlier track.
EDIT: If you search for "Enigma Posteriori DSD" you'll find various matches from Chinese sites where this is a 1-disc edition without the added tracks from earlier albums. In the meantime I'm 99% sure this is an RBCD but wonder: was it actually recorded in DSD or do they just put that on because then they can charge more for it?
I am 100% sure that this is a fake.
First of all, China Record Co. doesn't distribute Enigma recordings in HK....Virgin does. That's no such company as China Record Co., although there's the State-owned China Records Co., which has 2 SACD titles list at sa-cd.net. Both of which were pressed by Sony in Japan. On top of that, HK releases of Western titles don't alter the artwork by putting in Chinese text onto the cover.
As for DSD-CD, Hong Kong music companies are indeed releasing many DSD-remastered CDs due to a trend in reissuing old recordings. But certainly not for a current recording such as this one from Enigma. A DSD-CD doesn't have to be recorded in DSD; it can just be remastered with DSD. Many artists have had such treatments in the US....Elvis, Brian Eno's catalog (originally rumored to be reissued on SACD), etc.
Above is a pic of the OBI strip from a DSD-remastered CD from Hong Kong Warner Music.
BTW, HMV HK is hardly the place to look for SACDs in HK, online or otherwise.
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Post by Julien March 31, 2007 (19 of 21)
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soundboy said:
Almost all Hong Kong pop SACDs are music from 70s and 80s, Julien. Almost none of the current HK pop singers have any SACDs out.
Most are, that's true. And most HK SACDs I've heard, even though more interesting musically than most of what they record now, were bad recordings from the start, I don't believe SACD is improving much.
Most of the Chinese pop music has nearly always been recorded without any accoustic instrument, but rather bad quality electronic sound. The voices, see Cai Qin for example, were most of the time too closely miked with second rate microphones I believe (same for that French Barbara SACD I own).
There are very good recordings of Chinese music, but unfortunately most of the very well mastered SACDs are either Channel Classics or made by western engineers (or Japanese). Otherwise the good ones are all CD.
I guess you will strongly disagree with me on this one, since you own every single one of them. In my opinion, until now the Chinese pop releases on SACD are a waste compared to what the format can bring. As well as the ABC records SACDs I bought recently.
The essential reason for having audiophile formats is the original quality of the recordings.
Of course, I hope I'm being wrong anyway. There are so many I haven't listened to, and even though I don't particularly appreciate that kind of music, I would like to know which are the ones you consider could prove me wrong.
Many of my hi-fi dealer friends would appreciate.
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It's a ps3 for sake. A friggin video game machine.
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