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Finally got my beloved Marantz SACD player. Woo Hoo! Love it, love the way it sounds. Curious though--the instruction manual states that very few amps and speakers are ready for the full frequency range of SACDs, and I should leave the filter on. When I get an SACD ready amp, then I can turn the filter off. My amp is a Musical Fidelity A308 and my speakers are Vandersteen 3a Sigs. Are they SACD ready?
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jdaniel@jps.net said:
Finally got my beloved Marantz SACD player. Woo Hoo! Love it, love the way it sounds. Curious though--the instruction manual states that very few amps and speakers are ready for the full frequency range of SACDs, and I should leave the filter on. When I get an SACD ready amp, then I can turn the filter off. My amp is a Musical Fidelity A308 and my speakers are Vandersteen 3a Sigs. Are they SACD ready?
For sure.
20 years ago, when CD was introduced, everybody asked you:
is your equipment ready for CD ?
Especially low frequencies cannot do any harm neither to your amp nor to your speakers. If your amp (and I don´t think your musical fidelity has any problems with it) isn´t capable of low frequencies beyond 15 Hz, the unit simply will not amplify these frequencies. There is furthermore no danger that your speakers can be damaged (that would be a problem, if your amp went into High-frequency clipping due to overload).
Ask Marantz, why cheap units with built-in CD/DVD/SACD players at 300 EUR overall price including speakers are sold as SACD ready?
I´m sure this is a price everyone who is addicted to music spends for speaker cables.
So don´t worry and much fun with your SACD.
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Post by zeus March 16, 2004 (3 of 14)
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jdaniel@jps.net said:
Finally got my beloved Marantz SACD player. Woo Hoo! Love it, love the way it sounds. Curious though--the instruction manual states that very few amps and speakers are ready for the full frequency range of SACDs, and I should leave the filter on. When I get an SACD ready amp, then I can turn the filter off. My amp is a Musical Fidelity A308 and my speakers are Vandersteen 3a Sigs. Are they SACD ready?
I have a Marantz player and Musical Fidelity A300 (the predecessor of yours) and it took me about 18 months to work up the courage to move the filter to "custom". And I live to tell the tale! The "custom" setting isn't full-range, it just moves the roll-off frequency up. If your amp doesn't show signs of getting too hot, you're pretty safe.
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Post by mdt March 16, 2004 (4 of 14)
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jdaniel@jps.net said:
Finally got my beloved Marantz SACD player. Woo Hoo! Love it, love the way it sounds. Curious though--the instruction manual states that very few amps and speakers are ready for the full frequency range of SACDs, and I should leave the filter on. When I get an SACD ready amp, then I can turn the filter off. My amp is a Musical Fidelity A308 and my speakers are Vandersteen 3a Sigs. Are they SACD ready?
The full frequency range of SACD is a theoretical limit.The extended frequency range mainly serves to move necessary filters far out of the audible range.Also keep in mind that an SACD will only contain what was recorded and only some of the newest mics can capture frequencys up to 50k so nothing above that is going to be on any SACD,in most cases probably even less.
However the extra capacity of SACD in frequency and dynamic range together with principal advantages of the DSD process allow reproduction of the musical signal with utmost precission, so there actually are high demands on speakers for SACD.They should be as precise and neutral as possible, not to save them from damage but for the listener not to lose lots of SACD's benefits.
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Post by Khorn March 16, 2004 (5 of 14)
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I found that switching to 'custom' on my Sony SCD-1 resulted in what I would best describe as more "air" on really well recorded material. I have left it in that position ever since.
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Post by Dan Popp March 17, 2004 (6 of 14)
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My understanding is that Delta-Sigma-modulated signals (DSD) produce very-high-frequency artifacts (read: distortion). Since this distortion is not within the so-called "audible" range, the signal can be converted without a filter, although the filter would give you a less-distorted picture.
This is not to say that those who like the distortion are wrong; upper harmonic distortion (or "generation," if you like) has been the basis of more than one magical audio gizmo - the Aphex Aural Exciter comes to mind.
Will it fry your tweeters? Probably not. But if it does, the lawyers at Marantz can say, "See, it says right here in the manual...."
FWIW, I have a Marantz player and haven't listened to it without the filter. I guess now I have to.
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Post by mdt March 17, 2004 (7 of 14)
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Dan Popp said:
My understanding is that Delta-Sigma-modulated signals (DSD) produce very-high-frequency artifacts (read: distortion). Since this distortion is not within the so-called "audible" range, the signal can be converted without a filter, although the filter would give you a less-distorted picture.
This is not to say that those who like the distortion are wrong; upper harmonic distortion (or "generation," if you like) has been the basis of more than one magical audio gizmo - the Aphex Aural Exciter comes to mind.
Will it fry your tweeters? Probably not. But if it does, the lawyers at Marantz can say, "See, it says right here in the manual...."
FWIW, I have a Marantz player and haven't listened to it without the filter. I guess now I have to.
I have read that D/A conversion of a DSD signal is basically as simpel as passing the digital signal through a low-pass filter, the output being the analog signal. At which frequency would that filter be placed and would'nt it eliminate the "very-high-frequency" artefacts as well.
(with the possible uper frequency limit being 100k i imagine the filter could be well above 20k moving it out of the audible range and still below the region where the artefacts appear)
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Post by Dan Popp March 17, 2004 (8 of 14)
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From the SA8260 manual, page 7:
"*Switching the filter setting has to be done while the unit is in stand-by mode. If the setting is switched while playing, noise may occur."
From the same manual, page 17:
"*Do not change the [filter] switch setting while the unit is in stand-by mode. Doing so could generate electronic noise that could damage your speakers, etc."
Oy.
If we could divine the proper way to change the switch setting, it's not clear from the manual what it actually does. Is this ultrasonic filter in addition to the filter used for DA conversion? Looks like it could be, in which case my earlier answer is irrelevant as usual. But given the level of instructiveness of the instructions, and even the names of the switch settings ("custom" is a non-configurable setting provided on every model at the factory!) I think it's time to poke it and see what happens.
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Post by zeus March 17, 2004 (9 of 14)
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Dan Popp said:
From the SA8260 manual, page 7:
"*Switching the filter setting has to be done while the unit is in stand-by mode. If the setting is switched while playing, noise may occur."
From the same manual, page 17:
"*Do not change the [filter] switch setting while the unit is in stand-by mode. Doing so could generate electronic noise that could damage your speakers, etc."
Oy.
Pull the plug out, switch it to "custom" then forget about it!
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Post by Dan Popp March 17, 2004 (10 of 14)
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My results:
I tried A/B'ing some material that seems to border on "too much high end information" already. I was suprised that the difference is so easily audible, and also that I could literally A/B it.
"Custom" does open up the high end. On my system, to my ears, the tradeoff was some harshness or hardness that I don't like. The "Standard" setting sounded more round and analog-like. That's where mine will be. If I want more highs I have a "treble" control for those few discs that could use it - which are usually CDs anyway, come to think of it.
I cautiously switched (with the amp very low at first) in Standby, in Play, in Stop... and I never got it to make so much as a chirp. If it works the same on yours (remember, the lawyers warned you!), you'll also be able to A/B it and get a good idea of which setting you like better.
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